Ephedra HCL feels similar to Adderall

Ephedrine muscle protection

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Jannimaus
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of Jannimaus »19 Dec 2006 21:55

I already posted it in the thread "Ephedra and brain cells" ...
The longer and higher ephedrine is taken, the stronger the Nw will certainly be.
But I am convinced that all stimulants, hormones ect. so is.
You should at least look at the facts carefully before taking them.
And that's the good thing here on Andro ... you can get great information.

Greetings JM.
"Always breathe easily through your pants"

maxpayne
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of maxpayne »Dec 20, 2006 8:12 am

zane100 wrote:
maxpayne2 wrote:I thank you! However, I'm already through with yohimbine, never again
but I will test effe and K!

thx


@ maxpayne
Why that? I'm thinking about giving Yohi a try. Were your experiences so bad that you no longer want to use this preparation for me?


I had the worst nw I had never felt so uncomfortable although I paid attention to what you are not allowed to eat under y!
My y-hcl was first-class goods, most of them have average crap
In any case, the results weren't that great, rather crap ....
And you get a water storage under the skin of y, at the beginning of the diet it may work but if you are already advanced and suddenly your shape from the water gets worse again then that sucks ...
Fucking afterwards is never as nice as you imagined it to be before wanking!

Cario
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of Cario »Dec 21, 2006 9:24 am

Hi,

woltle times to ask ephe; how long it should be taken before training and how long it works (50-100 mg)

Dicky
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of Dicky »Dec 21, 2006 2:08 pm

to maxpayne

i also ordered y from abroad and everything was ok with me, no nw, you can simply drink stinging nettle tea with the water tank, it drains the body; Almost all women drink during pregnancy because the body stores water during this time

what shouldn't you eat if you've taken yohimbine, I've heard about it, but I don't know exactly what you shouldn't eat

could you list a few things ???

thanks


zane100
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of zane100 »21 Dec 2006 14:32

Slightz wrote:
maxpayne2 wrote:Efedrine, when, how often, how much?

THANKS!!!


3 times a day 20-30mg ephedrine with 200-300mg caffeine, the best fat-burning effect is achieved when the ratio of ephe to caffeine is 1:10. I also take aspirin with 250mg each, but the majority here say that this is nonsensical, instead you can still use yohimbine 20-30mg a day.


Hi Slightz,

I wouldn't advise you to do that.

Yohimbine is an MAO inhibitor! And these should never be combined with ephedrine. Because the potentiating effect could be very dangerous or even life-threatening for you.

Please don't do this to yourself.

Greeting
Zane


hotspot
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of hotspot »Dec 21, 2006 3:17 pm

Dicky you should avoid carbohydrates with Y, so an anabolic diet is very useful.

Because Mao inhibitors also avoid the following foods:
Pineapple, bananas (tyramine), Chianti wine (tyrosine), cola and similar drinks (caffeine), dill, fennel oil, fish (tyrosine), poultry liver (tyrosine), coffee (caffeine), cheese (tyramine), parsley, horse beans ( Tyrosine), tomatoes (tyramine), chocolate (tyramine)

There are also interactions with the following drugs:
Combinations with certain drugs such as dextromethorphan (DXM) or drugs such as ecstasy, mescaline or amphetamine derivatives and many others can be life-threatening!

zane100
Is Ephedrine a Mao Inhibitor? It can be made from methamphetamine, i.e. it is related to amphetamine - the effect is similar, but I don't know how strong the Mao-inhibiting effect really is.
In addition, I think that this effect is negligible or do you have other information about it?


zane100
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of zane100 »Dec 21, 2006 3:38 pm

@ hotspot

I don't have any detailed information about it either. There are different interpretations. Even if there is a slight doubt about it, I would still be extremely reluctant to take Yohi and Ephe in combination.

My health is worth that much to me.

Greeting
Zane


hotspot
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of hotspot »Dec 21, 2006 5:14 pm

I checked again- yohimbine and ephedrine are Mao inhibitors, so they should both potentiate.
I wonder where then are the reports of symptoms of intoxication ...? From a purely logical point of view, the ECY combo should be toxic. And as high as some partially dose ...
Would like to know more about it.

Micha K
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of Micha K »Dec 21, 2006 5:28 pm

Ephedrine, like other stimulants, leaves behind so-called neural traces in the brain, which can remain for years, if not a lifetime.
I have a friend who can no longer tolerate ephedrine. Neither physically nor mentally. Why is not very clear. There is no study that goes over such periods of time.

Interesting thesis - and quite conceivable for me. However, I still wonder whether such reports might not be due to other causes. What makes me skeptical about this thesis is the fact that ephedra and ephedrine were also used to treat asthma - and that is usually a long-term treatment, right? Shouldn't such effects have become known?
Greenway writes that ephedrine was used as an asthma drug for many years - apparently without any problems.

Caffeine or theophylline combined with ephedrine has a long history of use in prescription medications to treat asthma. In fact, caffeine / theophylline and ephedrine were the standard treatment for asthma in adults and children in the United States until more specific ß-adrenergic stimulators were introduced in the 1970s (4).

http://www.obesityresearch.org/cgi/repr ... 7 / 1152.pdf



PS: Another nice summary about ephedra (again in English) ...
-> http://www.herbalgram.org/files/pdfs/EphedraMono.pdf


zane100
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of zane100 »Dec 21, 2006 5:58 pm

@ hotspot

Ultimately, it is not conclusively certain whether Yohi belongs to the group of
MAO inhibitors is assigned. There are also opposing views on this in science.

@ rantanplan

The active ingredient concentration in asthma medication is extremely low and therefore difficult to compare with the doses often administered in bodybuilding. Certain "side effects" and the psychoactive effects that can be traced back to the ingestion of ephedrine only occur above a certain dose threshold. Which can be very different from person to person.

Greeting
Zane


Slightz
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of Slightz »Dec 21, 2006 6:43 pm

hey, after about 2 weeks the psychoactive effects of ephedrine fizzle out and you start to feel like you did before. As you know, until recently, ephedrine was still used for the long-term treatment of asthma, the effect that we "bodybuilders" use of ephedrine is basically just an undesirable side effect in medicine. Years ago studies were carried out on the subject of brain damage, and it was found that ephedrine and amphetamine only cause permanent brain damage as an intoxicant, which is taken in very high doses from time to time, and regular consumption of low doses mostly "only" leads to impaired concentration after weaning, which should go away after a few weeks. After weaning, the dopamine and adrenaline stores are empty, so you feel limp and listless for a while.
Kind regards

Micha K
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of Micha K »Dec 21, 2006 7:06 pm

zane100 wrote:
The active ingredient concentration in asthma medication is extremely low and therefore difficult to compare with the doses frequently administered in bodybuilding.

For asthma treatment, the same dosages are usually given as they are also used for diet purposes (somewhere between 25-50mg per single dose) - nothing with "extremely low". On the contrary: In the Ephe studies on weight loss, the dosages are usually lower!
See also Greenway article in the Prortal:
Ephedrine combined with methylxanthines including caffeine was a standard treatment for asthma in the 1960s and 1970s, and was sold for many years without prescription. In fact, it was the serendipitous finding of involuntary weight loss by a general practitioner in Denmark treating his patients with asthma using a caffeine and ephedrine product that initiated the use of this combination for the treatment of obesity.
Ephedrine products are sold without a prescription for the treatment of asthma and have a recommended dosage of up to 150mg per day.
(...)
There have been a relatively small number of serious adverse events reported to a surveillance system in response to government requests to do so, compared with the widespread use of herbal products containing caffeine and ephedrine. These reports are not an objective method upon which to restrict the use of these herbal products containing caffeine and ephedrine. This statement is based upon several observations. First is the safety and efficacy of caffeine with ephedrine documented in the scientific literature for the treatment of obesity. Second is the history of safety using higher doses of caffeine and ephedrine as nonprescription medications for other uses. Thirdly, the side effects seen with the acute use of caffeine and ephedrine reach placebo levels in a few weeks of continued treatment.
This suggests that the safety of caffeine and ephedrine used chronically for weight loss is at least as great, if not greater, than the safety of ephedrine and methylxanthines in the acute treatment of asthma. Lastly, the levels of caffeine and ephedrine contained in herbal products for weight loss are less than the amounts of caffeine and ephedrine recommended for sale without a prescription for other purposes.

See e.g. also here:
Harefuah. 1994 Sep; 127 (5-6): 166-8, 215.
[Ephedrine psychosis]
[Article in Hebrew]

Shufman NE, Witztum E, Vass A.
Jerusalem Institute for Treatment of Substance Abuse.

Ephedrine has both alpha- and beta-adrenergic activity, and both direct and indirect effects on receptors. Its stimulatory effects on the central nervous system are more prolonged, though less potent, than those of adrenaline. It raises blood pressure both by increasing cardiac output and inducing peripheral vasoconstriction. It is still commonly used as a bronchodilator. However, since prolonged use leads to decreased effectiveness, patients tend to increase the dose themselves. The clinical picture of ephedrine psychosis resembles that induced by amphetamines: primarily a paranoid psychosis with delusions of persecution and auditory and visual hallucinations in a setting of unclouded consciousness. We present a 57-year-old woman who had been taking a usual dose of ephedrine for bronchial asthma (50 mg 3 times a day) for more than 30 years. When her husband died she developed depression, for which she tried to use ephedrine as an antidepressive, increasing the dose to 500 to 1000 mg a day over the course of half a year. She developed paranoid psychosis with delusions of persecution and auditory hallucinations, despite a clear sensorium. Recovery was rapid after ephedrine was gradually reduced to 200 mg a day and a small dose (200 mg) of the neuroleptic thioridazine was added.


Also interesting:
As a sympathomimetic agent similar in structure and activity to amphetamines, there has been a dispute over whether ephedrine produces some of the same neurodegenerative effects. It has been shown clinically that certain amphetamines (namely (d) -amphetamine and (d) -methamphetamine) can cause varying levels of long-term dopamine depletion in dopamine-rich brain and nervous centers such as the putamen and the basal ganglia.

Several studies have recently compared the quantities of such neurotransmitters as serotonin, dopamine, glutamate, and adrenaline after concurrent administration of ephedrine and various amphetamine-like agents. The results showed that ephedrine has a reduced neurotoxic effect on dopamine than its amphetamine counterparts.

Ephedrine increases serum dopamine levels minimally in comparison with an equivalent dose of dextroamphetamine (Adderall®). Dextromethamphetamine (Desoxyn®) raises dopamine levels dramatically (more than two times that of an equivalent dose of dextroamphetamine). This supports the general consensus that ephedrine has more of a peripheral action on the sympathetic nervous system, whereas amphetamines appear to cross the blood brain barrier more freely and tend to have a stronger central action. The fact that dopamine is believed to play a major role in the addiction response has been used in recent years as justification for controlling the distribution of dextroamphetamine and dextromethamphetamine, along with various other amphetamines

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ephedrine
Last changed by Micha K on 09 Aug 2008 09:33, changed a total of 3 times.


zane100
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of zane100 »Dec 21, 2006 8:17 pm

rantanplan wrote:For asthma treatment, mostly the same dosages are given as they are also used for diet purposes (somewhere between 25-50mg per single dose) - nothing with "extremely low".


Theoretically yes.

However, the amounts administered by many BB'lers are i. d. Usually much higher. The reason for this (unreasonable) behavior can usually be seen in the fact that many athletes gradually increase their dose if the stimulating effect does not take place.


bulkolly
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of bulkolly »22 Dec 2006 01:59

zane100 wrote:
rantanplan wrote:For asthma treatment, mostly the same dosages are given as they are also used for diet purposes (somewhere between 25-50mg per single dose) - nothing with "extremely low".


Theoretically yes.

However, the amounts administered by many BB'lers are i. d. Usually much higher.The reason for this (unreasonable) behavior can usually be seen in the fact that many athletes gradually increase their dose if the stimulating effect does not take place.


According to the package insert, the recommended dosage for the Spanish Ehedrina Level is 3 * 50 mg per day. That is significantly more than most people use.
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hotspot
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of hotspot »22 Dec 2006 02:06

bulkolly wrote:
According to the package insert, the recommended dosage for the Spanish Ehedrina Level is 3 * 50 mg per day. That is significantly more than most people use.

And that will be used long-term and probably also on young people? or was - the product has meanwhile been replaced by NW poorer ones in this area, right?


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